Discussion in 'Halo and Forge Discussion' started by oVR, Jun 22, 2013.
Great idea. I agree 100%
Whoah, whoah, whoah, wait. I don't want to be beating a dead horse here guys, but these "changes" are additions and modifications, not removals. And you can disagree with what I think needs to be removed, but the way to go about a rehaul isn't to just throw more features on top of the site and go "we're a new site! huzzah!" And no, the solution isn't "well there's an option to disable it". I really don't want to be continually dredging up an argument, but these are things that NEED to be seriously considered maturely, and what I see here are people unwilling to throw away their multiple unused birdfeeders because "I'll use them someday!"
"We use signatures for maps!" Yeah, and does anybody click those links?
"We need X rank!" No, we don't. This community is tiny to begin with, and yes that extra color really does matter.
Like oVR said, a map portfolio section is perfect; but again, what do you need to do to make that happen successfully? Tear down and build back up. You can always bring features back when the site has earned the ability to handle that kind of feature. For right now, they're just yet another thing in the way of what actually matters. You're stuck in nostalgia if you think the way the site was/is is okay... this forum was already old technology in 2009, things move incredibly fast in the computer world, and if you're not moving forward, you're getting left behind.
I agree with your general take on removing dead weight, but not with all the specifics - which is probably where we get bogged down: trying to agree on what can be removed without being hugely annoying to lots of users, or even detrimental to activity.
To name the main example I'd strongly disagree with you on, sigs are good (as long as there are size restrictions in place - either automatic ones, or ones enforced by moderators). They visually break up the page and the monotony of top-to-bottom text. They provide another easy way besides the small avatar to quick-ID someone you know. They're about the only form of non-rule-violating advertising on the site, which is actually a good thing IMO because it gives an outlet to something that is incredibly annoying and infractable in other contexts. And finally, to answer your direct question, yes I click on sigs all the time. A well-made banner can bring maps to people's attention even if (or especially if) they don't frequent the map forums anymore, and can also advertise other stuff that spreads activity around the site. I had a colorful TCOJ banner for a long time that I think probably got several more pairs of eyes, at least, on our customs lobby.
If it were me signatures would just be completely removed. Nobody reads or looks at them, they clutter up the forums and you increase scrolling needlessly. I'd also remove pointless information like the postcount, location, member since, and the on/offline icon which clutter up the area near the avatar. Also, nobody in the history of the internet has ever use the Like or Share function for forums posts, not sure what that's even a thing.
So much unnecessary clutter. The current (and previous) forums already look busy enough without the stuff I just mentioned, really.
Edit: I will say that I can understand why people want to keep signatures to advertise their maps, but that's mostly because the site is and has always been pretty bad at allowing people to find certain maps quickly. Being able to search for maps from a specific person more easily would go a long way. What if there was a link under someone's name which directs you to a page with all of his maps with thumbnails showcasing them? Now that's something I could get behind.
I wish you guys would stop throwing the words "everybody" or "nobody" or "everyone" or any other all inclusive words. Your personal beliefs as well as whatever number of people you know for certain believe as you do do not make up the beliefs of an entire group of people. Assuming you think for everyone will only lead to a lot of anger later on. Just ask Microsoft about that.
And to insane, I'm positive removing sigs has nothing to do with the fundamental core of the site nor is it essential in fixing any problem. If users don't like them, they can hide them, if users like them they can view them. Forcing one view on the other side doesn't fix anything other than making the other side not want to stay or at the very least they'll be bitter and not a positive force around the place.
We can look into optimizing space in so many non offensive to people ways that you guys aren't even mentioning because you're so busy thinking about what would satisfy you the most
Nobody looks at signatures.
Yep, a portfolio.
I only look at my own.
I look at signatures and used to do a shop for them. I still make them and avvys for people that like my masterpieces.
I'm not sure if this is also a suggestion thread, but one thing that I keep running in to is that when I try to scroll down to the bottom of the page, the chatbox always scrolls down to the bottom before the thread does. It's just an annoying aspect due to the change in how to chatbox is oriented (chats scrolling down, not up.) Possible solutions would be to put it back to chat messages sent in the bottom of the cb and messages scrolling upwards. Or if it is to be kept how it is, make it so that a user has to click on the cb to interact with it, ie chat, scroll up, etc. Or the cb could be moved to the bottom of the page, but I don't like that and it would probably result in few people using it.
Another solid idea in my opinion. The only reason people should want signatures is to advertise their map. Anyone who says keep it because they want to share their art is just on the wrong forum. This is a Forging forum not an art gallery. I know that sounds harsh but it's true. If you were to use the idea that Overdoziz said about having a direct link to that users maps then signatures would be completely unnecessary, meaning they could be removed to clean up the forum a bit.
This is a community. With your logic we should also get rid of the other games discussion board, off topic, halo discussion, any other board and thread that isn't specifically about forge or forging. People can have other interests outside of the main purpose of why they signed up. If all we were was a dumping ground for people's maps there would be no point to having a forum to retain people's interests and promote healthy discussion.
And it's already been established from people on here that there are members who look at them or actively use them. Until I start hearing about numerous stories of unique users not joining the site because of sigs I find the entire discussion very egocentric.
The merits for don't match or outweigh the merits against and if the primary reason against them is forum optimization and screen real estate there are all sorts of design changes to these posts and the board structure in general that can be done without removing them. If you just don't like looking st other people's images, again you are given the option to turn them off.
The difference between sharing your map and sharing your art is not exactly a wide chasm.
However, an automatic portfolio for every user would be very cool.
I agree. It's something I'm sure we'll work on.
Signatures are an integral part of forum culture, and there are no valid reasons to remove them. Even if you insist that merely gazing upon a signature is harming your fertility or shortening your lifespan, you still have the option to disable them on your own.
As for a link to people's maps, we already had that with the Reach database before the forum updates. There is no reason that "View Maps" can't be put back into the clickable dropdown on a member's name.
Well THAT isn't going in my achievments! And besides which, NOBODY is going to look at FH, make loads of posts, and then look and say "Oh. SIGNATURES? WITH LOVINGLY CRAFTED AAAAART? Screw this site!"
Sorry if its sarcastic, but just because we are going back to our roots doesn't mean we should get rid of something that works. It's like buying a new set of mugs and saying "well screw you, Yorkshire Tea! I'm going to throw it all away and get some horrible own brand stuff! Just because i'm doing things differently!"
on right now vs. on in the past 24 hours is a big difference. Forgehub wasn't dead. But by your terms I guess even right now it is dead.
Heck, had I known ForgeHub was for sale I would've bought it.
It's sad to see a site I used to frequent very often turn into what it has.
Well, I can't say I wasn't expecting this to happen. I am glad though, as I've been busy getting back surgery and recovering. Wish you guys the best of luck.
I just prefer simple forums which focus on actual discussion. That's the entire point of forums after all. So many forums have unnecessary clutter which just makes them messy and unpleasant to read.