Does BTB Throwdown sound like a good idea?

Discussion in 'Halo and Forge Discussion' started by Loscocco, Mar 16, 2013.

  1. Loscocco

    Loscocco Promethean
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    Since most people here can agree that Infinity BTB crushed their hearts, I was thinking of making a BTB Throwdown gametype, and possibly adding a commentary and petition on Waypoint/Halo Council to see if 343 would consider improving BTB by adding a separate BTB playlist. On top of that, I would really love to see if anyone here supports the idea and would want to be in custom lobbies for this.

    A LOT of people really dislike a lot of features in Infinity BTB, one of the most played playlists in Halo 4. The DMR's range and perfect precision (the top complaint) makes maps like Ragnarok unplayable, spawning with plasma pistols and grenades ruins vehicle combat, it's sad that there's no such thing as objective BTB, etc...

    I find it pretty disappointing that when I decided that Infinity Slayer sounds awful before Halo 4's release, everyone said "don't worry, only a fraction of Halo 4 will be forced to play it" yet it is shoved down my throat if I want to play so many things, mainly the only 8v8 playlist available. Even now, old BTB lovers are hesitant on buying the Castle Map pack because it just means more Infinity Slayer DMRs on open fields...

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    The gametype that I'm making addresses common issues, mainly getting rid of custom loadouts, where players can ruin map movement, vehicle combat, etc... using DMR, Plasma Pistol, Plasma Grenade classes.

    (basically this is Team Throwdown 8v8, with subtle differences)

    1: Forced Loadouts:
    -BR, Magnum, Frags for everyone
    -Any initial armor abilities? Maybe set it up like Reach where every loadout is the same aside from AA choices.
    -Maybe give everyone the Driver perk so vehicles aren't made of paper?
    -Resupply

    2: Non-ordnance weapons actually spawn on the map (edit default maps to incorporate this)

    3: Personal ordnance?
    -If no armor abilities, do the same thing as Throwdown (thruster, shield, and hologram as choices)?
    -Or maybe let users pick between 3 constant power weapons?

    -I think the general consensus is that people don't want other people randomly rolling a die and pulling an Incineration Cannon out of their ass from around the corner for racking up a few assists.

    4: Add forged BTB maps, and customize any default maps to include basic weapons spread around, and maybe rebalance the maps to accomodate for Throwdown settings.

    5: If it were a playlist, it would feature objective gametypes as well.


    I'd love to hear people's opinions on this idea, especially those that are avid BTB players.
     
  2. Starship Ghost

    Starship Ghost Spartan III

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    I made that exact gametype but I never got a chance to try it with 16 people, lol. I agree to everything though and I'll support it of course since BTB was my favorite gametype and now it's ruined (in matchmaking). As far as 343i listening and doing anything to BTB online... nope, don't have any faith in that. They haven't done anything we wanted with anything except nerf the Boltshot and that took 3 months. They are so damn slow even if they did listen to us and change stuff, Halo 5 would be out by the time we saw the changes.

    But as someone else mentioned before, BTB is the #1 most populated playlist so 343i probably sees that as a complete success and won't change anything. Even though you want to ask for an alternate playlist, at least that is much more of a possibility. 343i is controlled by Microsoft, who doesn't give a **** about anything except money. Maybe if we had a fundraiser and raised millions of dollars microsoft would tell 343i to add a BTB throwdown playlist :p

    EDIT: Can't actually put Wheelman perk in the loadouts since it's a specialization... yeah that's stupid. So we'll have to fly that paper airplane we call a banshee. But at least it won't get DMR'd 2 death in 5 seconds. Other issue with the loadouts is there is like 8 armor abilities and you have to sacrifice 3 I believe. Nobody cares about the turret... but the rest people like. I personally only use the thruster for the most part.
     
    #2 Starship Ghost, Mar 17, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2013
  3. Cassel

    Cassel Heroic

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    Here's my 0.02$ (assuming this is a playlist).

    -Tone down the anti-vehicle power on weapons and leave it limited to anti-vehicle weapons (rockets, fuel rod, etc)
    -Forced loadouts without plasma pistols, plasma nades or DMRs, limited abilities, etc)
    -Incorporate actual user made 8v8 maps rather then dumping players into small and cramped 6v6 maps.
    -Get rid of personal ordinance.
    -Incorparate real objective gametypes (no pistol flag, real CTF, etc).
    -No map ordinance. Instead, default weapon placement.
    -Limited vehicles. You don't need a tank, a wraith, a banshee and a guass warthog on one one map (exile).
    -Proper scoring.
    -Classic gametypes.

    I know not all of that is possible, or simply just won't happen, but that's just in a perfect world. Oh well.
     
  4. Kazerra

    Kazerra I Beat the Staff!

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    As much as I'd like to see this happen, it probably won't. As mentioned before, BTB is by far the most populated playlist (it doubles the population of Infinity Slayer at peak times).

    Also, the introduction of Team Throwdown didn't dent the population of Infinity Slayer, so 343 would be reluctant to introduce a BTB Throwdown playlist because it might go the same way.

    It sounds like a brilliant idea, but for the majority of people who play Halo 4, they seem to like standard, messed up BTB. 343 aren't going to change things for them.
     
  5. theSpinCycle

    theSpinCycle Halo Reach Era
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    This idea needs a prize.

    Personally, I would say no to personal ordnance. Not too sure about how forged BTB maps will handle framerate in this game (16 players sounds like a lot to me) and we have lots of dev BTB maps.


    YES TO OBJECTIVE BTB. Twenty times yes.
     
  6. Waterfall

    Waterfall Heroic
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    BTB has always been my favorite, but in halo 4 I rarely play it for its lack of objective games. I agree with everything said above especially giving everyone the vehicle perk.(forgot what it is called). Custom maps are a must to me as long as they are carefully selected, maybe let the community vote on a handful of great maps.
     
  7. pyro

    pyro The Joker
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    While I love spawning with three plasma grenades and pulling incineration cannons out of my ass, I do wish we could just play the game instead of abusing it.
     
  8. Pegasi

    Pegasi Promethean
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    I would absolutely love to see this happen, but I too think it's unlikely.

    It's kind of oxymoronic in terms of appeal. If we had a venn diagram of people who are attracted to the "classic" Halo (insofar as BR starts, stripped down approach to ordnance and loadouts in general) and those who play BTB in Halo 4, I think the overlap would be very minimal.

    Yes, you can argue that a fair number of those who would play this gametype are put off by the current iteration of BTB, thus aren't accounted for in those numbers, but I still think those numbers are minimal. I couldn't see this playlist having a healthy population if it did happen, and low population hurts an 8v8 playlist a lot more than a 4v4 one.

    Sad, though. I've been playing a lot of Throwdown recently and love BR only games. I've really come round on the BR vs DMR debate, and enjoy the BR more in terms of both basic use and the kind of gameplay it promotes (more movement and fewer cross map battles stagnating flow). It's sad that the only way to make it a truly viable option is to remove DMRs entirely as a loadout option, but I'm enjoying the game a lot so far, despite the fact that connection is much more important with the BR than the DMR, something that I suffer with regularly.
     
  9. theSpinCycle

    theSpinCycle Halo Reach Era
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    I think it doesn't have to be anything huge to get a large audience. No personal ordnance (or at least no incineration cannons and such in ordnance), no plasmas or plasma pistols off spawn, and BR starts only on maps that need them (Ragnarok).

    Perhaps the name shouldn't be "BTB Throwdown," but I feel the concept is valid.
     
  10. REMkings

    REMkings BIOC
    Forge Critic Senior Member

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    I'd love this. It would make BTB a lot more fun again because one of the most popular features from BTB back in the days, the vehicular gameplay, would actually be appealing again. If 343i would implement this and at some point also give us back the Falcon, I'd be very, very glad. (I know they won't do the latter.)
     
  11. Starship Ghost

    Starship Ghost Spartan III

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    maybe someone should start a petition. :p
     
  12. Loscocco

    Loscocco Promethean
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    I feel like quite a few people would play a more hardcore BTB. I think the reason no one plays Throwdown is the same reason why no one played Arena, MLG, Zero Bloom Slayer, etc... in Reach was because there are so many casual players that don't want to go into a playlist riddled with people that are actually trying their hardest. BTB is the kind of playlist that features such a wide spectrum of players of all skill levels: from people derping around with mongooses and explosives to extremely serious competitive teams.

    I feel like a BTB Throwdown would attract a lot of the people that aren't hyper competitive, but just hate playing Infinity settings or just hate the things like the DMR.

    I definitely think 343 actually listening to someone like me (someone without a very loud voice) is unbelievably unlikely, but maybe at the least we would have some fun custom lobbies on the site where we can play BTB without losing brain cells.


    I would, but I'd want to capture some gameplay of it first and make a commentary or something. Then I'd have to work on making a massive post that accurately expresses my opinion and doesn't piss anyone off at the same time.
     
    #12 Loscocco, Mar 17, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2013
  13. Kazerra

    Kazerra I Beat the Staff!

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    I smell a new weekly customs lobby brewing. As long as we can get enough players each week, I'd more than be up for custom BTB with the settings you've proposed.

    There are a few excellent BTB maps already on the site - it'd be nice to play them more often and just have a good laugh.
     
  14. Starship Ghost

    Starship Ghost Spartan III

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    I'm definitely down for a weekly BTB customs lobby.
     
  15. Fenix Hulk

    Fenix Hulk Mythic
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    8v8 Dust-Up anyone?
     
  16. Kazerra

    Kazerra I Beat the Staff!

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    That would work. The Dust-Up settings are pretty much identical to Loscocco's proposition.
     
  17. WWWilliam

    WWWilliam Legendary

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    Big reason why I like AR starts 4v4 and Bloom for BTB in Reach.

    I like the DMR better but without been able to be knocked out of scope and no bloom it would probably have to be a BR.

    No personal ordnance, Big part of BTB is map control, Unless if really needed to impliment it have only one choice so there is no choice in what your ordinance is and make it something balanced, I was thinking something little like a speed boost, Or perhaps a weapon that soft counters vehicles (not like rockets or anything) something like concision rifle or a couple frags solely for purpose of if your getting camped by vehicles and you pick off people you can push out of it easier. But still only one of them so players don't get a choice which Personal ordnance to use (so other team knows when they could have it) and then they have the choice when to use the ordnance.

    With weapons on map you would have to choose your own weapons which you would have be be very careful about to make it balanced. (I can't help I haven't played enough BTB seriously in Halo 4 to know how much each weapon counters each vehicle and vise versa(can't just judge from previous games) and from that info knowing if they should be neutral spawns or team spawns)
    If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.

    So be good to do some tests and gameplay and stuff to learn more and make your findings more elegant.
     
  18. Pegasi

    Pegasi Promethean
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    Fair enough, I personally feel that's too restrictive in terms of practical engagement ranges for a starting weapon, but to each their own.

    Trite nonsense. Some things are complex. Apply this principle to quantum physics and see how far it gets you.
     
    #18 Pegasi, Mar 18, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2013
  19. WWWilliam

    WWWilliam Legendary

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    I dunno, This sounds pretty simple, The Origin of Quantum Mechanics (feat. Neil Turok) - YouTube

    My point was just looking deeper into the subject and finding out more learning more for gameplay trail and error will make future threads aimed at 343i because you understand the subject better will make them more simple and to the point and elegant and more likely to catch on and achieve something.
     
  20. pyro

    pyro The Joker
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    Why are there four paragraphs of text preceding this?
     

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