Race Standard Gametype?

[goldman 010]

well i figure that we could probly do like an oval race track or some turns with it on sandtrap. the only problem is that we need a little more money. :squirrel_chatting:

[AZN FTW]

Is it just me or does that have nothing to do with the gametype?

Anyways, as I said Glim, PM me when you have the Standard down and intact and known among the Racetrack builders.

[marquis madness]

ya, the gametypes fill my memory :squirrel_sad:

[pinecone2654]

I want to know if a mongoose can go through a loop. just wondering......

[M0KKAN]

A racing game type needs to accomplish several things:

1) Tally Points
I would suggest using the VIP gametype that awards a point for arriving at a destination. Using a single waypoint with random regeneration at some set time provides a simple way to count laps. The only problem is the annoying 'Waypoint Moved' voice that yells at you every 15 or 30 seconds. The less I have to hear this, the better, so I would prefer a 30 second regen rate.
Also, the VIP settings should be set to ensure that every team always has a VIP.

2) Promote Racing over Fragging
As anyone who's played Rocket Race knows, when racers fall off of a mongoose, they tend to begin a slayer style battle. This tends to disrupt races and is less fun for everyone. So we need to discourage people from fighting.
A) Take away weapons: Players should spawn with a weak(or no) weapon with the least amount of ammo possible.
B) Set damage to a low setting. We should be careful here as setting it too low will prevent melee attacks from detonating fusion cores which is a common feature to allow players to suicide themselves back to spawn points.
C) Set shields and armor to a high setting. Same problem as B).
D)Grenades. I think frag grenades are a fun mechanic that allows fallen players to slow things down while they remount their goose. Grenades should not respawn as this encourages payers to stay off of their mongeese and huck grenades - you'll just have to use the 2 you start with wisely.

3) Discourage running anywhere
When players are on foot, they should be loosing ground to the faster mongoose. The best way to do this is careful map construction. However, some obstacles are slow going on a mongoose and with a limited forge budget, some walls can not be built high enough. Player speed should be set low(25 or 50%) to discourage people from running across tracks to shortcuts. The same thing applies to jumping. Increasing gravity makes it impossible to jump even the lowest barriers which allows forgers to use less budget on walls and deterrents . I'd suggest maxing gravity as a standard gametype - maps that are somehow dependent on jumping will require their own gametype.

I'll review my gametype and look at others and post an initial suggestion for all settings later today or maybe tomorrow.

[szafranko]

instead of most of the time people going doubles... why not let the VIP go in a vehicle...? more vehicles more mayhem?

[Glimflicker]

Originally Posted by M0KKAN

1) Tally Points
I would suggest using the VIP gametype that awards a point for arriving at a destination. Using a single waypoint with random regeneration at some set time provides a simple way to count laps. The only problem is the annoying 'Waypoint Moved' voice that yells at you every 15 or 30 seconds. The less I have to hear this, the better, so I would prefer a 30 second regen rate.
Also, the VIP settings should be set to ensure that every team always has a VIP.

If you set the VIP goal area to move every 30 seconds, you're assuming that every track that uses this gametype will have at least 30 second long lap times. Several tracks have lap times far below this, which creates a problem for it being a standard gametype. Perhaps the standard should be 15 seconds, and you can edit it higher if needed in your custom lobby.

Originally Posted by M0KKAN

2) Promote Racing over Fragging
As anyone who's played Rocket Race knows, when racers fall off of a mongoose, they tend to begin a slayer style battle. This tends to disrupt races and is less fun for everyone. So we need to discourage people from fighting.
A) Take away weapons: Players should spawn with a weak(or no) weapon with the least amount of ammo possible.
B) Set damage to a low setting. We should be careful here as setting it too low will prevent melee attacks from detonating fusion cores which is a common feature to allow players to suicide themselves back to spawn points.
C) Set shields and armor to a high setting. Same problem as B).
D)Grenades. I think frag grenades are a fun mechanic that allows fallen players to slow things down while they remount their goose. Grenades should not respawn as this encourages payers to stay off of their mongeese and huck grenades - you'll just have to use the 2 you start with wisely.

I don't remember the exact settings that I used for Bungie 500, but I'm fairly happy with the final values I used for shields and damage modifiers. One thing to note about giving players grenades is that even with two grenades, griefers can commit suicide repeatedly and get more. I think it's worth the peace of mind to just not give players grenades--the threat of assassination is bad enough, you don't need to encourage them with explosives too.

Originally Posted by M0KKAN

3) Discourage running anywhere
When players are on foot, they should be loosing ground to the faster mongoose. The best way to do this is careful map construction. However, some obstacles are slow going on a mongoose and with a limited forge budget, some walls can not be built high enough. Player speed should be set low(25 or 50%) to discourage people from running across tracks to shortcuts. The same thing applies to jumping. Increasing gravity makes it impossible to jump even the lowest barriers which allows forgers to use less budget on walls and deterrents . I'd suggest maxing gravity as a standard gametype - maps that are somehow dependent on jumping will require their own gametype.

I feel that 200% gravity is probably a good idea, but I'm not so sure about the reduced movement speed. If you legitimately get separated from your mongoose, you're at such a disadvantage anyways. If you then add a 75% speed reduction to the player trying to get back to a usable mongoose, he's out of contention already. Players are already slower than a mongoose, so I think it's better to prevent running through the goal marker with map design rather than crippling everyone with lower speed.

[Glimflicker]

Apologies for the double post, but I didn't see this when I replied earlier:

Originally Posted by szafranko

instead of most of the time people going doubles... why not let the VIP go in a vehicle...? more vehicles more mayhem?

Only the VIP going through the goal area triggers scoring. This means that if your teammate isn't the VIP and is racing around on a mongoose by himself, he'll never score any points. This coupled with the limited number of mongeese (8 on all the maps I can recall) makes it almost necessary to only give one teammate the ability to drive. I think it works best when the VIP can drive, but non-VIPs can't. This allows you to have 8-player games with 8 separate VIPs that can race. If you then have 8 x 2-player teams, the VIP can still drive as he could before, but now his teammate can hop on the back and help him out.

Basically, I think that Rocket Race got it backwards. There would be far less of a slayer feel to Rocket Race if you could still compete when your teammate gets randomly dropped. You still run the risk of having an idiot teammate as the VIP, but it's better in other regards at least.

[M0KKAN]

All good points Grim. I really haven't gone racing with anybody except a group of friends who want to race, so there's not really a problem with 'griefers' as you call them.
We should probably come up with settings that we all agree on and then work out the details. Something I've been thinking about is having two(or more) standards available. For example a 'short track' and a 'long tack' standard would benefit from having different scores to win, waypoint spawn times, and possible character speeds. Hot laps on an oval is a bit different from the more complicated obstacle based tracks. 1 man teams and 2 man teams would be another option. Obviously we wouldn't want too many standards or we'll have accomplished nothing, but two or possibly three could work. Also just changing things in the lobby works too...

These settings were intended for a 1 player per goose race (teams of 1). Functionality for teams of 2 (mario kart style) will have to be added.
Anyway, here is an initial list of settings: (feel free to copy and past this list with your own settings)

I) Score to Win: 5 (10 for short tracks?)

II) Single VIP: Disabled

III) VIP Settings:
1) Next VIP: Unchanging
2) Scoring:
A) VIP Takedown Points: 0
B) VIP Death Points: 0
C) VIP Betrayal Points: 0
D) Kill Points: 0 (Possibly -1 to discourage assasinations?)
E) Kill as VIP Points: 0
F) Goal Arrival Points: 1
G) Suicide Points: 0
H) Betrayal Points: 0
3) VIP Death Ends Round: Disabled
4) Goal Areas: Enabled
5) Goal Movement: 30 Seconds (15 for short tracks?)
6) Goal Movement Order: Random
7) VIP Traits:
A) Shields and Health:
a) Damage Resistance: 200%
b) Shield Multiplier: Normal Shields (2X overshield prevents suicide - good or bad?)
c) Shield Recharge Rate: 200%
d) Shield Vampirism: Unchanged
e) Immune to Headshots: Enabled
B) Weapons and Damage:
a) Damgae Modifier: 50%
b) Primary Weapon: AR (SMG or Magnum would probably work too)
c) Secondary Weapon: None
d) Grenade Count: None
e) Grenade regeneration: Disabled
f) Infinite Ammo: Disabled
g) Weapon Pickup: Disabled
C) Movement:
a) Player Speed: 75%
b) Player Gravity: 200% (jumping levels will require lobby adjustment)
c) Vehicle Use: Full Use
D) Sensors:
a) Motion Tracker Mode: Unchanged
b) Motion Tracker Range: Unchanged
E) Appearance:
a) Active Cammo: Off
b) Waypoint: No Waypoint
c) Forced Color: Off
8) VIP Proximity Traits:
A) Influence Radius: Disabled
B) Others: N/A
9) VIP Team Traits:
A) All: Unchanged

III) Weapons and Vehicles:
1) Primary Weapon: AR (Only matters for teams of 2)
2) Secondary Weapon: None (Only matters for teams of 2)
3) Weapons on Map: No Weapons
4) Grenades on Map: None
5) Vehicle Set: Mongooses only (I still think it should be Mongeese)
6) Indestructible Vehicles: Enabled
7) Custom Powerup Traits: N/A

IV) General Settings:
1) Number of Rounds: 1 (series matches would be set up in the lobby)
2) Time Limit: 10 mins
3) Base Player Traits: N/A (only matters for teams of 2 - feel free to add this in if you're a team fan)
4) Respawn Settings:
A) Respawn Time: 10 secs
B) Suicide Penalty: None (Fusion cores are the only way to suicide - this would be intentional in order to get back to a spawn point and a new goose)
C) Betrayal Penalty: 10 Secs (only possible on teams of 2)
D) Lives Per Round: Unlimited
E) Advanced Respawn Settings:
a) All: N/A or Unchanged
5) Team Changing: Not Allowed
6) Friendly Fire: Enabled
7) Betrayal Booting: Enabled


This is just a starting point. The more input we get now, the better and simpler racing will be.

[UEG Stewball]

I think this is a great idea and a couple things that I would like to add are:

1. For shields and health, I personally believe that everyone should be invulnerable. The one thing I hate is when I'm trying drive and some guy just decides to gun me down.

2. For VIP vehicle use, I think the VIPs should be able to drive, but in order to make sure that people don't have their teammate camp a part of the track, put in a proximity trait for the VIP so if the teammate goes out of range, he would basically become useless.

3. And for weapons, I think that a good weapon would be the sniper rifle, with unlimited ammo and 0% damage modifier. The reason being is that the sniper rifle can mess up people's ability to drive, without being: A. too precise; B. too overpowering; and C. too deadly.