MLG Standards: Weapons/Powerups allowed and why.

[DeathstarsOG]

First off i want to say being a part of the MLG community and seeing all the major maps designed i know whatis acceptable to place on an MLG map. This thread will have nothing to do with design, creation, or ideal layouts for MLG maps, however i may expand upon those areas in the future.
The reason i believe this post is necessary is the fact that 80% of the maps posted in the MLG section of Forge Hub do not meet MLG standards. Then another 25% of people think they know the rules but really don't and are spreading false information and leaving bad feedback.

I'd like to start off with the BR first. This will cover where they should be placed, along with extra clips amount, respawn times, number placed on map, and why they are used or NOT used in MLG.

Everything you need to know about MLG weapons:

-Battle Rifle:
The BR has been an idlized starting weapon since it was introduced in Halo 2. The speed of fire combined with accuracy at nearly all ranges made it the best friend of every spartan and the pistol of Halo CE was forgotton. This weapon is highly powered and acurate which blends it into a test of skill between players. Hence the phrase "get out br'd"
This weapon will always be the starting weapon of choice for MLG gametypes. Placement of BR's on an MLG map should be in high trafic areas. Places where you can pick up the ammo easily and keep going. Usually with 2 extra clips on a 10 second respawn. Ideally, anywhere from 4-16 is perfectly fine and usually determined by budget when the map is nearing completion.

-Covenant Carbine:
The carbine is obviosly the covenant form of the BR. It has some advantages over the BR due to it's high firing rate. The BR is a four shot kill where as the carbine is a seven shot kill. However you can squeeze off 7 shots with the carbine before the BR can pelt of 4, 3 shot bursts. The advantage of this over the BR makes the carbine used less often on maps sorta like a powerweapon. The result from that is an average of 2 carbines on most MLG maps yet usually anywhere from 1-4 are placed on a 2 spare clips, 90 second respawn rate. These are usually placed on sym maps across from eachother, yet not at the base or starting spawn areas. On asyms, you will usually only see one carbine on the map, on higher ground(doesn't mean it has to be that way).

-Sniper Rifle:
The sniper rifle is a highly accurate weapon that takes alot of skill to use properly. It has the potential for a one hit kill so i can be overpowering. Lines of sight should always be looked into before adding a snipe to the map. The extreme accuracy yet high skill level needed to operate makes the snipe happily accepted into MLG. Map size and design probably play the biggest role on wether or not a snipe is used, how much ammo it contains, and how many are placed on the map. Never put more than 2 snipes on a single map for MLG. It is overkill. With powerups/powerweapons, you must use good judgment when using them. If it's a foundry asym, one 12 shot snipe is perfectly fine. On pit, two 12 shot snipes are acceptable. If adding more than one snipe on a smaller map(ex: blocked off foundry map) limit the ammo on each snipe to an 8 shot or even a 4 shot. The MLG standards for snipe respawn time is 150 sec. and it must be drop spawned(I'll explain more on that later). Snipers should be placed where they must travel to get to higher ground. This is not always true though. If you want to place it up high, do it somewhere that is really lacking cover to make it dangerous.

-Rocket Launcher:
While the rockets seam like a noobish weapon, they can create better gameplay. How? Simply by putting a power item such as rockets somewhere makes it something to be controlled. Controlling a power item takes teamwork and that is a highly wanted feature in MLG. Saying this doesn't mean to go throw rockets in every map you make from now on. Just like the snipe be cautious of where your putting it. Placing it in a small room based map or area kills gameplay as it's almost a gaurenteed kill and 25% will be either a suicide/betrayal along with it. Rockets should be placed in a dangerous area to grab or at a point where both teams will meet atoff starting spawn(this is called an opening rush, i'll explain more later) Rockets should be set to a 120-180 sec. respawn and should be decided based on size and layout of the map. The number of extra clips should be 0-1 creating a 2 or 4 shot rockets. Using rockets and ammo amount should be decided based on map size and design just as snipe.

-Mauler:
The mauler is the poor mans shotgun. Under MLG settings you can still get a one hit kill by aiming for the head at very close range. If that one hit doesn't kill follow with a punch to finish. Mauler can be devastating at close range. I've seen one person run through an entire team on Gaurdian snipe side with the mauler/beatdown combo. The strenghts of this weapon are in room based maps where the battle is close range. Remember it's effectiveness when placing it. No more than 2 maulers should be used on a map no matter the design and usually placed in the dead center of a sym map making it "neutral" to both teams. Spare clips are up to the mapmaker and design of the map. Open maps can usually afford to have more ammo count as they won't be too overpowered. The choice for this to be used in MLG can be thought of as the BR's close range counter. A simpler way to explain is: Snipe is to Shotgun, what BR is to Mauler. As far as respawn times 60-120 sec. is the average respawn times for this weapon however I prefer 120 to prevent camping(more close range weapons can promote camping).

This next section will cover the more controversial weapons to MLG and when they are acceptable.

-Plasma Pistol:
This weapon can be just as strong as the mauler at close range and also be a great combo with the BR to quickly take down enemies. However it must be thought out before placing one on the map. Why add a plasma pistol to your new map? A good reason to add one would be as a counter weapon. What i mean by that is it is used to counter other weapons/items on the map. A perfect counter setup for a PP is on a map that contains a custom powerup(overshield). Remember to think about why the plasma pistol is the correct choice and place accordingly. Also note, the mauler and PP are great counters to eachother but the PP will have a major advantage on an open map. Try testing between both mauler and pp to decide what plays better if you are not sure. Respawn times for this weapon is the same as mauler at 60-120 sec.

-Plasma Rifle:
The plasma rifle is really powerful at close range and can kill someone combined with a beatdown after just 3 bursts. It can also be combo'd with the br to take down shields faster (assisting or by yourself) for the kill. Now i hear the talk already "plasma rifle? might as well bring the AR into MLG" Well, i hate to say it but the plasma rifle take much more skill than the AR does at the same ranges. Why? Because the AR shot speed anything close enough to shoot will be hit as long as the aimer is pointed at them. However with the PR you must lead your shots more than any other weapon. And the farther they are, the harder it is to use. This creates a skilled weapon at medium range yet a powerhouse at close range. This can also be used to counter custom powerup just like the plasma pistol. Usually placed on lower ground with a 120 sec. respawn timer. Never place more than 2 plasma rifles on a map and usually only one will do.

-Magnum:
The magnum is a 5 shot kill weapon, however it's slow firing rate don't make it an ideal primary weapon. However it is probably the best non-power weapon to have as a seconday. Why? because the BR can run out of bullets and need to be reloaded and many times you'll find yourself in that situation with an enemy or two nearby. With the magnum in your back pocket running out of ammo with the BR won't necessarily mean you're going to die. I would almost recommend MLG updating there rules to have Magnum as a starting secondary. The amount of dual wielding would definately go up which would be the only bad thing about it being a secondary. Dual wielding is not forbidden but can be frowned upon, especially if you are dual wielding maulers. Testing would be needed to answer this of course.
Back to adding the magnum in your forge creation. Placement on these are not too definitive and being so, won't affect gameplay too much no matter what there placement. Usually 1-2 magnums are acceptable depending on map design and at a 60 second respawn is considered the norm.

Originally Posted by Ender

-Beam Rifle:
The Covenant version of the Human sniper is not very different. It does not have to be reloaded but overheats when fired too quickly. The major reason this is not used in MLG is because ammo cannot be collected with it. With the Human sniper, players can pick up spare ammo, but with the Beam Rifle, ammo is in the form of battery, which means you have to drop one Beam Rifle to pick up another. If a player wanted to steal another teams ammo, they would half to drop the ammo they had in exchange for a full Beam Rifle. I would recommend staying with the Human sniper all the time, but if you really want to use it, put it on a map that only has one sniper, which will greatly reduce the ammo situation.

I'd like to add onto this, that the sniper rifle will always be the preferred sniper to use by the pro's, but the Beam Rifle can take it's place fairly easily. Please have a reason behind using the beam rifle over the sniper rifle such as "the double shot possibility plays out better". Don't just put one in for a change.


continued..........

[DeathstarsOG]

This post will cover alot of weapons that aren't accepted by MLG as competetive and why.

These weapons are the ones used in matchmaking, as i will not cover weapons that matchmaking does not even accept.

Kick it off with the brute shot.

-Brute Shot:
This weapon while as great as it is, will never be accepted into MLG. Reasoning for it is the brute shots ability to exploit maps. You are able to get to places in maps that otherwise would be impossible. This brings the little kid out in people by creating camping, slowing and possibly destroying gameplay for a competetive map.

-Needler:
The needler has been a hated weapon by most since Halo CE. It was considered a "noob" weapon that not only has auto-aim but auto-tracking. That paired with a high rate of fire to basically spray and pray requires much less skill than a competetive sanction would back.

-Assault Rifle/Brute Spiker/SMG:
The ultimate noob weapon to some, it is the basic starting weapon for most gametypes in Halo 1 and 3. Well not in MLG. The spray and pray aspect is what destroys this weapons chance of being competetively acceptable. And you'll notice to be the downfall of most weapons that don't meet MLG's standards. Other weapons that i can classify here would be the Brute Spiker and the SMG. They all have the "hold down the trigger untill it's dead" use which ruins competetive play quickly as it requires much less skill to do.

-Energy Sword/Gravity Hammer:
While the sword has been weakened since Halo 2, it is still considered an overpowered close range weapon that requires little skill to operate yet capable of a one hit kill. The gravity hammer follows suit as it is just as powerful as the sword but has a splash damage to where you can get more than one kill per swing. Both of these weapons don't only create a no skill kill gameplay, they also promote camping. If peoplpe are wondering what i mean by camping, i'm stating that strong close range power weapons can be used to camp around corners and tight opening for cheap kills. While it may be acceptable in Matchmaking, MLG prefers not to participate as it slows down gameplay. These weapons were once in MLG for Halo 3 but were quickly removed.

-Flamethrower:
I don't think anything really needs to be said as why these aren't used in MLG. If you really do have no idea, i have one word for you: Camping

-Missle Pod:
The missle pod obviously isn't used because it is meant to bring down vehicles. Since MLG does not accept vehicles there is no need for this weapon.

-Machine Gun/Plasma Turrets:
The fact that these are unlimited stationary spray and pray weapons obviously kill it's competetive ability, especially with unlimited ammo. These should stay on Zombie maps only IMO, but are acceptable in MM. However if any of you have looked into the Bungie group Atlas, there are weapons in MM that are not acceptable from a user created map. The reasoning behind this is that is cause Bungie knows that some weapons only work on some maps in some areas and in any variation would create horrible gameplay.

Now onto what some believe has the potential to play well in MLG....
-Spartan Laser:
This weapon has the potential for a 1 hit kill and requires good accuracy. Can be compared to the Sniper Rifle in power, this weapon can kill you in one shot if it contacts anywhere on your body. This gives it a huge strength over the sniper and makes it easier to use. The tricky part is this item has a charge time. This charge time is what I believe to be it's biggest fault in working well in MLG. Since MLG is fast paced, the charge time on the laser could make it a completely useless weapon. If it were to be used, the best maps to use on would be larger, asymmetrical maps(could work on syms also). I truly feel that this weapon if placed correctly on the right map would work great but it has yet to be done. If it were ever to be used, there could only be 1 on a single map and work right. Feel free to test out ideas, but know that foundry is a bit small for a laser.


Onto Equipment

-MLG does not use any equipment outside of powerups(explained in the next post) and grenades. This includes: Powerdrain, Regenerator, Flare, Trip Mine, Deployable Cover, Bubble Shield, Radar Jammer, Deployable Gravity Lift(not to be confused with a normall grav lift always placed on a map).
Any use of these items are strictly for MM and even then not all of them are acceptable. There have been talks of bubble shield and flare being added to some maps but are purely rumors.
Do NOT add these items to your MLG maps.

-Spike Grenades:
These are debatable as to why they are not accepted, but most logically it is due to it's randomness of kills. Sometimes you can stand near it and your shields will be scratched, other times within the same distance, you get killed. Wins/kills should not be decided by something as random as spike grenades.

These weapons/equipment should NOT be used in MLG maps. There really shouldn't be much questions about it, but if you are still in need of more answers I am more than will to answer them to the best of my knowledge. Please continue onto the next post for more information regarding powerups.

[DeathstarsOG]

This post will cover the Powerups placement, necessity, purpose and everything else you should know.

-Custom Powerup:
In MLG the custom powerup is used as an overshield. You're probably wondering why not use the normal red overshield. Well the difference here is that this overshield is "burnable". What that means for those that don't know, is if your shields are down and you grab the custom, you will not recieve the overshields expected. If your shields are recharging or fully charged you CAN pick up the custom powerup without worrying about not getting it. Some tactics used by those that get shot near the custom is to pick it up(burning it) just so the other team doesn't get it if you die.
Another note about the custom powerup is it does NOT work in a free for all game the same. It reverts back to default speed boost. Remember this when making a map designed for FFA. Camo or Red OS are usually the better choices for FFA map varients. When placing custom, try to put it in an area of the map that is easy to access yet is highly visible. This is not always the case but generally plays well. Don't put a powerup in the hardest to reach spot as it completely ruins the concept.
Timer on a custom powerup is 120 sec. respawn and generally there is anywhere from 0-2 placed on a map. Having two must undergo some major testing and would usually be done on a larger symetrical map. Although it is very rare it can be acceptable if done correctly and balanced(not recommended unless you really know what you are doing and have tested).

-Red OS:
Although it is used less often, the Red OS is acceptable for MLG use. Smaller maps such as Foundry can use the Red OS if the Custom powerup will get burned so often that it's never actually used. Timers on these can be anywhere from 90-120 sec on average. Red OS's should be used in more open areas. One thing to note between the red and yellow overshields is the red OS once picked up gives you invinceability for 5 seconds. After the 5 seconds are up you have a 2X overshield that will take 7 BR shots to kill. The Custom powerup has NO invinceability but it does have a 3X overshield and should take roughly 10 BR shots to kill the player.

-Invisibility:
Otherwise known as Camo, is a great powerup that is MLG friendly. Camo tends to be the strongest of the 3 powerups especially in MLG where there is NO radar. It can almost be thought of as the ultimate power item as there can really be nothing better than to be completely invisible to the enemy. Invis also usually carries the same timer(120 sec), placement, and concept as the custom powerup. Burning a camo is basically the same as burning a custom. If you are seen on your way to get invis before the other team, make sure to grab it even if you are going to die. This stops the other team from getting there paws on it. Just like custom, placing 0-2 on a map is acceptable but needs to be there on purpose and have a reason. Both Custom and Camo have a safe amount of one of each used on a map. Using two Camo's should only be done on a larger Symetrical map and must be balanced.(not recommended unless you really know what you are doing and have tested)

-Useful tips on Powerups:
Never have more than two playable powerups(not used to mark scenery). That creates a cluster**** of powerups. Most MLG maps only house a single powerup. This is probably the safest way to go if you don't want to be controversial. However you can use two just fine with the right testing.
When deciding powerup placement, think of the LOS to it. Also try to put it somewhere it doesn't look out of place. Think on the Pit where custom is located now or where rockets spawn on MLG Pit. It makes the powerup feel like it belongs there and not like it was a random decision.
Have other weapons on the map that can combat these powerups. Plasma rifle/Plasma pistol are great counters for custom. Mauler is probably the best thing in the MLG weapon set(besides grenades) to fight the camo guy as they are trying to get close.

-Drop Spawning:
Drop spawning is basically what it sounds like. It's the act of a weapon spawning in mid air and dropping to the ground. Since the weapon falls from it's spawned location, it will respawn at the set respawn timer of 150 sec(MLG snipe timer) or really close to it. If this method is NOT used, the weapon spawn times will only be known by the initial team that picks them up. So basically if a sniper is drop spawned at 11:00, it will respawn at roughly 8:30. and keep that cycle throughout the game. The problem with drop spawning is the power weapon can usually still be "dirty'd". Meaning the weapon is picked up mid air. This can cause the spawn timers to get thrown off and depending on the maps setup the weapon won't respawn at the correct time or at all if the original is still being held onto.

When setting drop spawned weapons, you should always raise the run time maximum to atleast accomodate a second weapon of that kind to spawn. In simpler terms, if you have one sniper on your map you should have a run time maximum of atleast 2. If you have 2 snipers on your map, set the run time maximum to atleast 4 and so on. Remember, that is the minimum. All maps in MLG right now with sniper rifles on them are set to there max allowed which is 8. This will affect your budget in doing so. Run time maximum needs to be set higher so that if a sniper is on the map in someones hands, the new one will still spawn on-time. This keeps the timers as accurate as possible.

Another thing to note is that a drop spawned weapon will dissapear if not picked up as it acts as like it were dropped by a player. Don't let this happen if you want to get the edge over your opponents.

-Timers on Items:
When choosing the respawn time on all the items on your map, think about what the use of that object should be. If you want the map to have a faster pace, make power items respawn faster. If you need to slow gameplay down a bit cause it's too hectic, make the power items spawn later. The timers I gave you per item are a safe bet across the board but you can experiment. Remember, MLG wants the best competetive gameplay possible. Keep that in mind when laying out all your pickup items.

-End thoughts and ideas:
On MLG maps, weapon/powerup placement is critical. There needs to be a strong balance between everything. So far the only two forged maps to make the circuit have been Onslaught and Amplified which neither carry powerups or power weapons. There are Maulers, carbines and BR's. This setup is tried and true but does not play on Halo 3's engine ideally. Powerups/Power weapons can create much more interesting gameplay along with more team oriented strategies instead of the team with the better BR. If you haven't read the entire topic, please go back and do so. There shouldn't be anymore questions on this subject and anymore rediculous, non-MLG weapon sets in your MLG map. Feel free to ask any questions or add any thought to this.
Also remember, this is just a guidline. Sticking with these rules and information will make you a better MLG map designer. If this gets taken the right way by the ForgeHub members, i will go through and dig into Moveable and Immovable objects allowed on MLG maps.


Click here for MLG Standards: Items used and why.

[ForgeGod117]

Originally Posted by DeathstarsOG

reserved

What you cannot just edit the origional comment. This really helped me seeing as I am going to make a version of my next map that plays for MLG. Maybe you should add a section for custom powerup traits and map layout tips. I am itching for more.

[DeathstarsOG]

Originally Posted by forgegod117

What you cannot just edit the origional comment. This really helped me seeing as I am going to make a version of my next map that plays for MLG. Maybe you should add a section for custom powerup traits and map layout tips. I am itching for more.

The reason being is because you can only have so long of a post before you get cut off. I didn't want to get cut off and have to find out exactly what the cut off limit is and have to re-do my post again, so i just seperated it into three (soon to be long) posts.

[G043R]

First off nice post.. I agree with the idea of pistols as secondary weapons... And I don't foresee people over doing the idea of dual wielding the pistol all to effective..

[Matty]

Originally Posted by G043R

First off nice post.. I agree with the idea of pistols as secondary weapons... And I don't foresee people over doing the idea of dual wielding the pistol all to effective..

Pitsol Mauler would own.

You should never put 2 different duel weieldable weapons in the same map.

[Iv0rY Snak3]

Or even Plasma Pistol/Pistol...

[DeathstarsOG]

Originally Posted by Matty

Pitsol Mauler would own.

You should never put 2 different duel weieldable weapons in the same map.

Definately a good point. I tried to stay away from saying never or always because in rare situations the rules can be bent a little as long as it doesn't negatively affect gameplay.

[G043R]

SO Pistol Mauler would own at close range... making a SHot Melee and Shot shot kill?