Urban

[GermitTheGR0G]

I like the map myself and I do agree it is kinda hard to maneuver around but that is also a good thing. It makes skill more important then other maps.

4/5 only because of the trip mine

2 grenades + trip mine in close quarters= Frame lag =(

[DxHydra]

Originally Posted by JustcallmeDrago

I'm very disappointed in this map. For the first match in the tournament it has horrendous gameplay. I honestly think that this map has the worst gameplay I've ever experienced. I've never played a map where it's so difficult to move around on. To get any good positioning, you must either do 2 crouch jumps or crouch jump after getting on top of a single box via a miniscule window panel ledge. But if you do, you're pretty much safe from anything the other team throws at you. The map is cramped. You have to concentrate on jumping all the time. The 2 stacks of fusion coils are virtually useless. The spawns are worse than terrible. This map almost gets to the point where it's a jumping contest. The forging is decent, nothing special. And it sure doesn't make up for the gameplay.

Sorry Shock, sorry Qrange, but it feels like you guys were making this map irritating on purpose.

at least there one person who thinks the way i do
this map is just plain not fun if your enemy has 1 sniper the mauler and a br and on top your team is screwed to next month and you cant get a good weapon because the respawn time are like 2 min
if you try to jump up to sneak attack them haha dumb idea you have to consetrate on jumping soo much that cant even look up to see them

also the AC is up top....uhhh shouldnt that be on the bottom to give the losing team a chance?
and the spawn camping is painful from up top you can see almost every spawn and with 2 people theres like 4 spawns you cant see
if you started with a BR it would give you a chance but they decided to start with AR's that the worst thing they did for this map the AR cant shoot that far when there up on the top

this map is just awful and it sadins me that this is in the doubles tournoment it dosent even belong on the front page
2.5/5
dont even bother flaming me because you know im right the only reason you like this map is because it was made by Shock Theta and Orangeremi
sry guys but its the truth

[Orangeremi]

Originally Posted by IcedFrappuccino

It seems like this map was rushed.

This map was started in production nearly 5 months ago.

I hope everyone criticizing this map should know that we've been testing these maps for months. If there has ever been a problem, we have fixed it.

[Matty]

Your all critisizing(sp) for all of the aspects of gameplay that you don't like. It's not that they are bad, its just that they aren't suited to your tastes.

This map is about fast paced, sometimes vertical combat, and promotes fluid team movement. If you can't keep up with the gameplay you will fail..

Your flawing the map because its too difficult for you? Thats what the 1 week of practicing is for.

[ooMUTE SPHINXoo]

does any body know his gamertag

[Furious D 18]

I'd like to express my opinions on this map, if no one minds.

Originally Posted by JustcallmeDrago

I'm very disappointed in this map.

Sorry Shock, sorry Qrange, but it feels like you guys were making this map irritating on purpose.

When I first played this map, I would have agreed with everything you said. I thought the map was too cramped, had too many difficult jumps, and was not enjoyable at all. But then I played it some more.

The more I played the map, the more I appreciated it. The jumps are difficult, but they are easy enough after you practice them. The map is tightly packed, but swift aiming with a BR can really put you ahead of your enemy.

I still don't like the vertical nature of the map very much, but that's mostly because it involves new gameplay for me. I'm mostly just used to aiming left-to-right, and now I have to practice playing in the 3rd dimension more. I'm used to "run and gun" gameplay, and now I'm adapting to "jump and gun" gameplay.

This is not a map that you just load up and dominate on. You really have to practice on it and adapt your play style. This map rewards teams that practice together. And that makes it a great first map for this tournament.

And by the way, teams that are working together closely can really shine on this map. Just wait until Devinish and I show the world what we've discovered. With a little luck (and if we can get it to work as planned) it's really awesome.

[Orangeremi]

Qrangeremi or Shock Theta.

[Shock Theta]

Originally Posted by JustcallmeDrago

I've never played a map where it's so difficult to move around on. To get any good positioning, you must either do 2 crouch jumps or crouch jump after getting on top of a single box via a miniscule window panel ledge.

Don't overstate your point. I've played on maps that bump you up constantly and trap you in unintentional gaps. It could be a lot worse but you claim it is, to paraphrase 'the worst'. Clearly incorrect.

This is immaterial of course, because you would expect a tournament map to aspire to a higher standard than that. I would claim that this map does.

There are two reasons why you might find the jumps too hard.

1. You haven't practised nearly enough
2. You aren't a proficient jumper

If you actually practice on this map, the jumps become second nature. There's a simple couple of jumps from stairs to top.

The first jump: You jump forwards and crouch, then you do the same again. It's not hard, at all.

The second jump: You jump onto a window panel, then you jump higher. You claim the small area of the window panel is a bad thing and yet the jump is utterly simple - take into account the fact that if it stuck out more then the alcove it resides in would be much harder to take cover in, making it very difficult to pick up kills with closer range weapons in that area due to a single extended and unbroken sight line. Effectively increasing the power of BR and snipe on the ground floor makes the map more unbalanced, but this is what that (your implied suggestion) would do.

The third jump: Taken from the angled bridge, it's a late-turn jump. Practice it. It's not that hard. There's a reason it makes you take half a second longer to position yourself though, and that's so that the snipe spawn is less protected and grenading people out of there is easier. *Epic Tactical Spoiler Removed*

That snipe spawn jump route has a lot of cover, and if the opponent doesn't have top, then it virtually guarantees you an escape from danger. So it has to be tweaked slightly for balance to prevent frustrating circular chasing around the map even if you have them at half shields. Oh, and you can jump back up onto the bridge at snipe spawn too.

Just think about these points for a moment. Do you think we don't know what we're doing? YOU haven't even thought about the basic map design and player routes, let alone anything else, or you wouldn't have made the comments you did.

Originally Posted by JustcallmeDrago

(If you make it to the top), you're pretty much safe from anything the other team throws at you. The map is cramped. You have to concentrate on jumping all the time. The 2 stacks of fusion coils are virtually useless.

The back room spawns have a BR. If you looked at the settings in forge, you'd see that it is on a 20 second respawn and has a run time of 6 with 4 placed on the map. That virtually guarantees that if you spawn there, or under snipe (both of which are likely with a team set up on top), both of you have a BR. You can also see anyone up top and have more cover than they do. If you team shoot, you can take one opponent down - then it's a 2v1.

The fusion coils are also visible from the corners of the ground floor, where these common spawns are in this situation. If you shoot them, they will net you a kill or a one shot on your opponent. The angle from bottom for a grenade is also rather simple to hit that area. So I'd say they are the opposite of useless. The corners where the fusion coils are placed have small corners at their sides. Looks like inaccurate forging, right? Wrong. They funnel those fusion coils that don't explode first out across the bridge to increase the chance of a kill. They also slightly increase the chance that a grenade will lodge there, blowing them up in the first place.

Originally Posted by JustcallmeDrago

The spawns are worse than terrible. This map almost gets to the point where it's a jumping contest. The forging is decent, nothing special. And it sure doesn't make up for the gameplay.

Sorry Shock, sorry Qrange, but it feels like you guys were making this map irritating on purpose.

The spawns are pretty reliable given the size and shape of the map. You have an AR. If you are in trouble soon after spawning, you can deal with it. If they are tagging you with BR, you will have cover if you learn the jumps rather than trying to rely on your shooting skill alone - a common mistake on this map. But that's not our fault.

I have already addressed the jumping more than adequately.

The forging doesn't have to be amazing. Are you looking for a conveyor belt in the middle of the map? The point is precision and to avoid distracting the player. I'm sorry we didn't give you a forged sculpure to look at whilst you simultaneously try to 4 shot someone across the map. :|

Originally Posted by DxHydra

at least there one person who thinks the way i do
this map is just plain not fun if your enemy has 1 sniper the mauler and a br and on top your team is screwed to next month and you cant get a good weapon because the respawn time are like 2 min

If the opponent has a snipe and mauler and BR:

1. You shouldn't have let them get into that position.
2. You will have instant access to a BR, and be able to control a snipe spawn. AR can deal with a mauler rush quite effectively. You don't have to rush them up top, because the time limit is so long (and in slayer there isn't one).
3. The snipe is on 2 minutes. So is mauler, but retrieving it puts you in poor position as a trade off. If you think the sniper is the only good weapon on the map then you are playing Halo all wrong. Think laterally. BR and AR is all you need, and you will have both. Out manouevour your opponent. Communicate. Don't just wait for a sniper to spawn because it's 'the only good weapon'.

Originally Posted by DxHydra

if you try to jump up to sneak attack them haha dumb idea you have to consetrate on jumping soo much that cant even look up to see them

I addressed this fully in previous comments...

Originally Posted by DxHydra

also the AC is up top....uhhh shouldnt that be on the bottom to give the losing team a chance?

Because then it would be right next to the mauler, and be ridiculously powerful. It's on a slow spawn. It's in the right place. You can't wait there for 2 minutes to constantly control it either, because there is no ammo up top and you'd need to cycle back down to pick up. If they've done this multiple times and you haven't taken the advantage, plus you haven't been able to BR or nade, or even AR (it's only medium range, it's very possible) them down from top, then they are simply better than you.

Originally Posted by DxHydra

and the spawn camping is painful from up top you can see almost every spawn and with 2 people theres like 4 spawns you cant see
if you started with a BR it would give you a chance but they decided to start with AR's that the worst thing they did for this map the AR cant shoot that far when there up on the top

I already covered this. I'll summarise the main points. You will almost always have a BR off spawn. In addition, the AR is more versatile on this map and shouldn't be underestimated even at ground floor-top bridge range. You can nade or shoot the fusion coils. You can team shoot with BR. You can choose not to rush. You can learn the jumps.

Originally Posted by DxHydra

this map is just awful and it sadins me that this is in the doubles tournoment it dosent even belong on the front page
2.5/5
dont even bother flaming me because you know im right the only reason you like this map is because it was made by Shock Theta and Orangeremi
sry guys but its the truth

I've just provided an ample and thorough explaination and refutation of your combined points against the map. I hope you take a considerable amount more time to formulate an argument against map design in future 2v2 tournament maps, because I assure you we did not just whip these up in a few weeks.

Sure, we could have made an arena style MLG map for every round, but that would be a complete waste of everyone's time. There's ample provision to go and compete in that style of tournament each month in the US and Europe. Instead, we've attempted to create a more rounded test of Halo skill. This map primarily tests your ability to react quickly and deal with increased vertical space. Other maps will challenge other aspects of your game in other ways.

Good day.

[{N}Nivlac]

LoL thats one of the longest replies I've ever seen Shock, but I guess it was needed, I like the map, but my friends say it feels more like a 1v1 map even though it's symmetrical and has 2 snipers.

[Novak]

Im not even sure if anyones said this before (Im assuming most people are whining about ONLY 2 BRS WTF GHAI), but I actually like the AR on this map. I really dont even pick up a BR unless its like... there. Ive been dueling the SMG and Pistol/Mauler and it works really well. Also tripmining then nading works really well on this map for getting kids who think camping in that window panel room is a good idea.